Opened 10 years ago

Closed 3 years ago

#6684 closed defect (invalid)

SAGA: ITE - Intro speech lacks pauses between phrases.

Reported by: SF/gaula92 Owned by: bluegr
Priority: normal Component: Engine: SAGA
Version: Keywords:
Cc: Game: Inherit the Earth


version: 1.8.0git82-ga224e28 (Jul 3 2014) game language: english version: talkie / dreamers's guild platform: linux / gcc

Intro speech does not make the pauses between phrases. These pauses are present in original DOS version.

This issue had already fixed months ago after I reported it in the IRC #scummvm channel, but I don't remember in what svn version.

It was working right for me until I updated sources today and rebuilt, so it could be broken for months.

Ticket imported from: bugs/6684.

Attachments (2)

ite_dosbox.ogg (783.7 KB ) - added by lordhoto 10 years ago.
ite_scummvm.ogg (764.8 KB ) - added by lordhoto 10 years ago.

Download all attachments as: .zip

Change History (22)

comment:1 by digitall, 10 years ago

Summary: Intro speech lacks pauses between phrases.SAGA: ITE - Intro speech lacks pauses between phrases.

comment:2 by digitall, 10 years ago

gaula92: Please can you try testing with v1.7.0pre, v1.6.0 (stable), v1.5.0, v1.4.1 etc. and see when this regression was introduced?

comment:3 by digitall, 10 years ago

The discussion about this problem and the patch for it was done on November 10 and 11th 2013. See:

comment:4 by digitall, 10 years ago

comment:5 by digitall, 10 years ago

I have checked around this date and there are no relevant commits to engines/saga for this. I suspect the fix is "turn off subtitles" or similar. You may want to check with and without this in ScummVM and the original.

comment:6 by digitall, 10 years ago

This could possibly be a regression from bug fix commit 8c1ca65 fixing (ItE: Subtitles always shown in introduction).

If the subtitles provided an implicit extra delay before the next spoken line which is not provided by an equivalent delay in the engine script code, this could account for the difference.

To test this, enabling subtitles should restore the "original" behaviour.

gaula92: Please can you test this? Thanks.

comment:7 by digitall, 10 years ago

gaula92: I have done some testing and the current "quick" intro behaviour is the same as it has been since well before v1.6.0... In fact as far as I can tell, it has always been like this.

I have spoken to LordHoto about the patch mentioned in that commit and provided to MrNutz (is that yourself?). This was but has now been removed and LordHoto did not retain a copy.

I suspect that the answer is that you applied this patch to your local source code... but it was never checking into the scummvm git repo.

If you still have a copy of this patch or your older source tree, then we would be interested in this... If not, this could take some time to work out. It should be noted that the patch provided was very rough and not really suitable to commit as-is, but should be useful to help investigation.

comment:8 by SF/gaula92, 10 years ago

Hi, digitall! Sorry it took me so long to respond. I've been building all sources I had from last year and later, and the only version where it's correct was the binay I was using until now. It's a 1.6.0 binary that, as you said, was manually patched. Yes, I was MrNutz before I registered my nick on freenode. I seem to recall it was a very simple patch someone came up with,but sadly, I was sure it would go upstream because it was such a good fix, and I don't have these sources... the pastebin you put there up is gone.

comment:9 by bluegr, 10 years ago

Commit 8c1ca65 (bug #6041) has nothing to do with this.

I went ahead and re-cheched the Windows versions, and couldn't hear any pauses between the spoken lines in the intro. Are you absolutely sure that there is an actual bug here? Are you perhaps loading the game from your CD-ROM? There would be a slight pause in this case, which would be what you're listening to.

comment:10 by digitall, 10 years ago

thebluegr: Agreed on that commit. If this is an issue, bisection shows it predates that commit and v1.6.0.

Comparing with the video from Wyrmkeep (which I think is running in the Windows interpreter), our implementation timing seems the same:

The only issue could be the cross-fade dissolve implicit delay.

gaula92: Is the delay you are referring to between lines that occur on different graphics? Can you time a "good" intro under DOSBox and a "bad" one under ScummVM and see if you can find any difference please?

comment:11 by SF/gaula92, 10 years ago

Hi all,

This video for example:

This is how the original DOS version sounds under DOSBOX. Forget about the OPL music, of couse it's different from wavetable/pcm used in the wyrmkeep version video. Just look at the speech. Look closely:

"We see the sky, we see the land, we see the water, and we wander, are we the only ones?"

"Long before we came to exist..."

These pauses are present in the mural part of the intro as dramatic pauses, and give the sense of an old storyteller telling about a distant, misterious past. They create an atmosphere, so they are important IMHO. In the video you pointed, these are lost. I don't know why: I never played that Windows-based wyrmkeep version, as I have the Dreamer's Guild DOS version. Maybe they did it wrong and the error has propagated, or maybe they use an old Scummvm version. I'm not loading anything from CD-ROM. I don't use optical media these days anymore.

comment:12 by digitall, 10 years ago

To be honest, I have played both videos together and I can't spot any significant difference. I suggest you do the same, syncing the video exactly...

comment:13 by criezy, 10 years ago

I also played the two videos, either one after the other or the two together and in both cases I found the difference between the two video was quite obvious. And I have to agree with vanfanel that without the pause the start of the sentence "Long before we came to exist" feels rushed and completely breaks the atmosphere.

comment:14 by SF/gaula92, 10 years ago

There is a very evident pause after the first phrase. There are many more in the mural scene.

comment:15 by digitall, 10 years ago

gaula92: SIGH. Since I am apparently "not serious" and incapable of hearing this difference, I will not bother investigating further.

comment:16 by SF/gaula92, 10 years ago

digitall, please, don't take me so serious. Sorry if I offended you. English is not my native language :( I edited the post. Sorry.

comment:17 by SF/gaula92, 10 years ago

I've also found the logs from the day the problem was confirmed and fixed on IRC:

It just seems that the patch was later forgotten :(

comment:18 by digitall, 10 years ago

Actually, you just pissed me off again twice.

Firstly, do not post-edit comments. Due to Sourceforge's new Allura platform, it is allowed, but badly implemented and does not get notified properly by e-mail etc. meaning updates get lost.

Secondly, I have already posted that IRC log from the official logs at in an earlier comment on this artifact.

Finally, It was not forgotten. I spoke to LordHoto, the patch was a temporary hack. As that patch was not saved by you and you failed to submit a bug until now that it could have been attached to, that patch has now been lost.

I am not offended, but it is clear I can not hear the difference you are indicating... so it would be better if a SAGA dev who can deal with this.

by lordhoto, 10 years ago

Attachment: ite_scummvm.ogg added

comment:19 by lordhoto, 10 years ago

I made recordings of the voice over of the intro in DOSBox and ScummVM. The only (major) difference I can spot is the scene transition time. Otherwise it's nearly identical... The pause you mentioned before "Long before we came to exist" definitely isn't any bigger in DOSBox than in ScummVM.

I attached both for comparison.

comment:20 by athrxx, 3 years ago

Owner: set to athrxx
Resolution: pending
Status: newpending

So, can we close this? I think lordhoto said all there is to say about this one...

comment:21 by bluegr, 3 years ago

Owner: changed from athrxx to bluegr
Resolution: pendinginvalid
Status: pendingclosed

I compared the two recordings that LordHoto provided, and indeed can't hear *any* audible difference between ScummVM and DosBox. The sound and narration is exactly the same, without any audible pauses between sentences in the DosBox version. I can only attribute the pauses you're stating to CD load times, which means they weren't supposed to exist normally.

Closing this

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